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Posted by webhostbeginner, 08-08-2006, 05:57 AM Hello, I need a Resller Hosting with H-Sphere control panel. Thanks,
Posted by CyberHostPro, 08-08-2006, 06:04 AM http://www.cartikahosting.com/ - they are a member of this forum and appear to use H-Sphere.
Posted by premium20, 08-08-2006, 10:45 AM When you talk about hsphere, some names come to mind: Jodohost Cartikahosting Vortech Hosting KnownHost Check for reviews on all these, and you should be on your way to a stable H-Sphere provider.
Posted by 2Macs Jim, 08-08-2006, 11:20 AM CartikaHosting (http://www.cartikahosting.com) or Netfronts (http://www.netfronts.com). Both are excellent and both have great support.
Posted by webhostbeginner, 08-08-2006, 12:41 PM I need only h-sphere, because my old server and controal panel is h-sphere and because I would like transfer my websites from old server to new server I need this control panel. please help me. Thanks
Posted by HostTitan, 08-08-2006, 01:14 PM If that's the case, a good host can help you transfer to a different control panel. Its not that hard and it would be the host's burden to do if they want to retain you! In any case, there are a couple good options mentioned in this thread if you choose to stick to h-sphere. Otherwise, there are quite a few control panels to choose like cpanel, directadmin, etc., where the hosts will be willing to set things up for you.
Posted by BF-Gary, 08-08-2006, 02:50 PM Checkout cartikahosting.com they offer great service w/o overselling.
Posted by mripguru, 08-09-2006, 07:30 AM Unfortunately, there's really no "automated" way to migrate from one hsphere account to another at this point in time. While a migration from H-Sphere to H-Sphere would be logical, it would more than likely involve a similar ammount of work/effort than to migrate to another control panel. However, in migrating to another control panel, you lose alot of the functionality that H-Sphere has as part of it's core: hosting automation. Hope this helps....
Posted by Shaw Networks, 08-10-2006, 02:39 PM Check out some of the top reviewed web hosts shared windows hosts over at HostSearch.com
Posted by samdax, 08-10-2006, 05:19 PM There is no automated way of moving account from h-sphere to h-sphere. If you want to change provider you will have to manually restore accounts and all settings + emails, so it is not important which control panel you choose. anyway, you have very nice list above (premium20 post)
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-10-2006, 06:04 PM I found it quite amusing that psoft created a way to migrate from cpanel to hsphere before they created an hsphere to hsphere migration utility. Certainly it is. Most people, once they have used and learned hsphere would not change platforms - they would just lose too much functionality.
Posted by ldcdc, 08-10-2006, 07:44 PM I find it wise in a way, but still pretty funny.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-10-2006, 08:03 PM agreed - but, I think it helps build loyalty in the brand even if a provider fails or if the provider just isnt a good match... its a feature I wish they would add - and if I check the 2.5.1 release docs, I would hope I see it there (as they are adding migration utilities from other CP's as well) - and actually - there is a way to move from hsphere to hsphere - and it is pretty fluid - its just not worth it for a typical reseller account and manual is actually faster - the existing mechanism is really only useful for migrating 100's to 1000's of accounts - which doesnt fit the "typical" definition of a customer migration from 1 provider to another.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-10-2006, 08:14 PM Well, no luck - looks like they improved the cpanel migration utility and added ensim - no automated hsphere to hsphere migration yet
Posted by IHSL, 08-11-2006, 01:08 AM Very wise indeed. A lot of H-Sphere hosts (and pSoft) have, for the longest time, made cPanel their number one target when trying to convert users. It's probably nothing more than just aiming for the biggest target. I don't subscribe to one being better than the other, I see them as answers to seperate questions. If they even need that functionality to being with. The users that need H-Sphere will find it by process of elimination. The users that don't need the 'H-Sphere only' tools may very well have good cause to drop it. Added functionality is great, as long as you actually make use of it. Otherwise it's just one more link on a page that you're paying for and don't care about. I've had cPanel users beg me to move them to a H-Sphere platform. I've also had H-Sphere users pining for the cPanel platform. Simon Last edited by IHSL; 08-11-2006 at 01:12 AM.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-11-2006, 08:50 AM my how times have changed cpanel is not in the same league as hsphere. The only thing cpanel has going for it is that people are familiar with it - after that, there is zero advantage. Yes, this certainly happens, and again, typically, its the familiarity with cpanel and peoples reluctance to learn a new platform, especially one that is a little more complicated at first glance... The future of the reseller business lies in the capability to offer a wide variety of solutions from a single interface. People may not "think" they need the features within hsphere until they start losing out on business where customers have asp/mssql requirements or ms exchange requirements, etc... Once a cpanel reseller starts missing out on this sort of revenue is usually when they start looking at hsphere or alternate solutions... and typically, once they are managing 2,3 or 4 different accounts across different providers and different platforms - they start looking for ways to consolidate and automate... margins are tight in this business and the future of reseller hosting is with multi solution platforms and increased automation - hsphere isnt the only option in this market, but, it certainly is the leader... and as of right now, cpanel isnt even in the game...
Posted by IHSL, 08-11-2006, 11:47 AM Not really. You are correct; they are not in the same league. Then again, they aren't competing for the same thing. H-Sphere is the best at what it does: All around automation. For a reseller that wants dual platform capability and inbuilt billing and support, there is no control panel that can lace H-Sphere's boots. On the other hand, cPanel is not going for that market. I don't see H-Sphere as more complicated. Sure, some cpanel providers try to pass it off as more complicated to lure users away, but the fact is that it really isn't a complicated platform when documented correctly. As providers, we do not have the right to tell users what they do and do not need. A reseller does not need to offer everything. They may be quite content with offering cpanel to their end users and having lower overheads as a result. Then again, H-Sphere may suit them down to the ground and they'll eventually make use of it. That's the users perogative though. Well, that was my point in my previous post. If and when they need the additional tools that H-Sphere provides, they will seek it out and it will be the answer to their prayers. If they never reach the point of needing automation and dual platform then there is really no need to move away from the cPanel platform. It's funny when you think about it: pSoft and the H-Sphere providers that target cPanel are paying cPanel a massive compliment without even knowing it. It's a risky game to play though. cPanel is a solid platform and has customisation and expansion options. It does its job as a leading single-OS control panel with great aplomb. At the end of the day, H-Sphere providers must be careful when targeting cPanel. When ever I see a Pepsi advert that involves Coke being labeled as inferior, I have a strange hankering for a Coke. Simon
Posted by webhostbeginner, 08-11-2006, 01:47 PM Hello oK! it seems that it is not possible to migrate the accounts automatically! Please help me how can I make complete backups?(databases+site+...) Thanks
Posted by ldcdc, 08-11-2006, 02:06 PM Still, Pepsi put up a good fight, for an underdog. http://www.drinks-business-review.co...0-8312F722ACCE I for one, see H-Sphere's image as a "pure reseller" solution, while cPanel/WHM can more easily be associated with "multiple domain hosting", or hosting for web developers that host a couple of sites for their customers. That's where cPanel can still have an edge, purely because it lacks particular features. Well, I would say that your point of view is more balanced now than it was two years ago, and your statements have more nuance now than they had then. The almost black and almost white are gray and gray now.
Posted by Yash-JH, 08-11-2006, 02:13 PM For site backups, you can use the webshell feature in HSphere to zip up the entire user directory and download it. For databases, you'd need to request your old provider to supply you with backup copies. Most providers should. Next setup your new reseller account. Create the end-user accounts, domains, databases and email accounts. You could then work with their support team in restoring files and databases
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 01:27 AM Agreed, but, we certainly have the right to predict the market place and build our offerings to suit our predictions - if we are wrong, the market will tell us so. Hello, as Yash suggested, you can use the tarball feature within your filemanager to backup your httpd content. You can backup your data bases directly from phpmyadmin. Ask your prospective hosts for help - most hosts will assist you in a migration if you setup your reseller account and have it ready to go.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 06:22 AM Multi-domain hosting is one of the strengths of H-Sphere, why credit cPanel for it's absolutely skewed implementation of add-on domains? Having worked with large fleets of cPanel servers, this is one of the major things that screws up. Users end up with corrupted cPanel files, and it's just not fun for the admin to clean it all up. This doesn't happen on H-Sphere. Not only that, but the directory structure on H-Sphere is *much* cleaner and makes a lot more sense. Honestly, if you want to start a host, do yourself a favor and use H-Sphere, cPanel is just plain outdated, their new skin isn't any better either. H-Sphere's skin, on the other hand, is very easy for customers to get used to, and it's also very user friendly. Not to mention that, but the skin is designed in such a way that a user cannot screw up their account and it also prevents them from making common errors in cPanel (like i've seen many users do) where they forget to add privileges for a MySQL user to the database...then they complain to support that's MySQL down...:\ I don't understand why anybody in their right mind would use cPanel, when there's a control available that is *much* better in absolutely EVERY aspect. When you can have complete automation, support, billing, a user friendly, foolproof interface, overall lower prices of systems administration (no cPanel bugs to deal with...and believe me while you may not worry about this when you're small since they seem rare, when you start getting more and more servers, this really starts to catch up to you!) how can you go wrong? Heck, I didn't even mention anything about the clustered services, and load balanced / high availability setups that are possible with H-Sphere. This control panel is almost *too* powerful when compared to cPanel. Last edited by layer0; 08-12-2006 at 06:25 AM.
Posted by Aussie Bob, 08-12-2006, 07:07 AM Cpanel's multiple domain strength comes with the WHM/cpanel combo, not addon domains. There's a massive market for multiple domain hosting, and WHM/Cpanel caters perfectly to that, and is simple for clients to use. Not everyone wants a total bundled solution. Some folks prefer to keep their support and billing as isolated as possible. I prefer to keep the support and billing separate, and not bundled with the servers. Kayako/modernbill is a good mix. Does the job very nicely. Folks just need to find what works for them, and roll with that. All this postulating about which is control panel/operating system is better, is meaningless and self serving. There's no best control panel. There's only the control panel that's best for you. Although I do find it funny how h-sphere doesn't provide a h-sphere to h-sphere migration tool. That's some wierd manipulative backward thinking there.
Posted by Aussie Bob, 08-12-2006, 07:20 AM So true. They're in different sections of the market, although they do overlap partially. WHM/cpanel is great for what it offers, and h-sphere is great for what it offers. If you're targetting the pure reseller market, the h-sphere has the edge with dual platform and billing/support bundled etc. I've always seen the reseller market as kind of temporary, with the successful resellers jumping onto bigger and better things (their own servers and staff etc), and the reseller account is just a stepping stone to them becoming your competitors. Tis a strange business where we breed our own competitors.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 08:12 AM WHM was not intended for multiple domains, though, it was intended for reselling. While I do agree that the best way to host multiple domains in cPanel is via WHM, people will still use add-on domains, and that's not good. Furthermore, WHM isn't very convenient in that it creates a separate control panel login, FTP, homedir, etc. for each domain. If someone has multiple domains that are all linked in some way, it cannot be done via cPanel. I know this is why I am moving some of my sites away from cPanel, for a better directory structure (via H-Sphere - or even DirectAdmin). That is, you have one username/password and the homedir is in the format of "/home/$username/$yourdomain.$ext" (well it's actually in hspheredocs or something to that effect for H-Sphere, but same idea). This is just much more convenient for the end user. For example if someone wants to host 25 or so domains, is it really convenient to have a separate control panel login and FTP for each? Not really. Have you used H-Sphere's billing system? It's quite amazing, and if you checked it out, I strongly recommend you do. A Modern Bill / cPanel integration ist just plain crap when you can have register domains, add them to your control panel, upgrade your disk space / bandwidth, change billing details all under one simple, foolproof control panel. People want their hosting to be simple. H-Sphere provides that. cPanel does not. I'm sorry, but when you have a buggy software like cPanel, it seems absolutely ludicirious to want to use it when there are so much better alternatives. Please tell me why you consider cPanel to be better than H-Sphere, give me a few reasons, I'd love to hear them. Yes, but I personally believe that H-Sphere is the most feature rich, intuitive control panel available for web hosts. You may not believe this now, but when you start growing a little more (IE 25+ servers) you are going to understand very well why cPanel just doesn't cut it. Now, I know Dotable is a very good hosting company (I use your services and I am thorougly satisfied), but I think it could be even better on an H-Sphere platform. I agree, but this really doesn't matter to me, when I can offer ~ 100% uptime (in theory...) hosting on one of the most stable platforms out there. I'm sure Psoft will realize the h-sphere <-> hsphere migration tool soon enough, though. Why is cPanel great? Or rather, what does it have over H-Sphere? They aren't really in different sections. Except maybe for the fact that is easier to find a H-Sphere host that's remotely close to decent...due to cPanel's heavy saturation (and the easy availability - through just about any 'cookie cutter' dedicated server provider, IE LayeredTech, SoftLayer, ThePlanet, Ev1Servers, etc.) making it more likely to find the 'bad' hosts. This is just from my experience - obviously there are plenty of cPanel hosts that are 'good', but you're more likely to find a good H-Sphere host. (statistically) End-users like H-Sphere. Having worked for a company that converted their end-users to H-Sphere from cPanel, I can tell you that the clients were able to get used to H-Sphere within just a few days and the amount of support tickets, etc. reduced substantially and the performance and efficiency of the hosting company itself thrived. Yes, but H-Sphere has the edge for *ANY* market, IMHO. Take it from someone who used to think cPanel was the best thing since sliced bread, yes, I admit that. In some cases, yes, unfortunately, we do breed our own competitors. But at the same time, many resellers choose to stay resellers as it makes it much easier for them to provide their clients with a stable hosting platform, with the prices and headache of managing their own servers, etc. Plus, many resellers just use the hosting services to compliment their web design services. So in a sense, many resellers are just distributing your services to local markets all over the world. That can be a very good thing Also, H-Sphere can make it easier to stop your reseller from being a competitor of yours. Just as an example, take a look at www.cartikahosting.com. What do they do? Shared Hosting, Reseller Hosting, Virtual Dedicated Clusters, Single Server Clusters, Dedicated Clusters. With H-Sphere, it's a piece of cake to migrate a reseller and their set of acounts from a reseller all the way to their own clustered environment. In this clustered environment, a reseller can offer load balanced, high availability solutions to their clients. Can cPanel do this? ...No, it cannot. Is it likely for a H-Sphere customer to start off with a reseller and move up all the way to their own dedicated cluster (seamlessly!)? Yes Anyhow, sorry for rambling, but I just think this post had to be made. Cheers all, P.S. If you decided to take the time to read my whole post, thanks! (sorry about any typos) Last edited by layer0; 08-12-2006 at 08:20 AM.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 10:14 AM Bob, to be fair, layer0 represents a cpanel provider - I dont find his posts self serving, quite the opposite actually - as hes recommending a solution other then what he uses. This is true of course - however, they ultimate key is to provide your customers a path to grow while still remaining your customers. Of course, to accomplish this, you need to provide the ultimate support, ultimate reliability and treat your customers like they are the most important thing (which really, they should be) - if you can do all of this, you will breed loyalty and that customer will grow along side you as a customer. I think this is where your crystal ball and my crystal ball are showing 2 different futures
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 10:30 AM Indeed, currently I am using cPanel and I do sys admin work for a few companies who use cPanel as well. cPanel isn't fun to administer, that's for sure.
Posted by ldcdc, 08-12-2006, 12:04 PM The best control panel/automation solution will still fail to achive its maximum potential if the marketing's not right. In a market where price weighs so much, you have to know how to present/sell things. Just like Linux, HSphere has a lot of enthusiast users, but that's just not enough if it is to win the war.. especially when the pricing differential is complicated to assess.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 12:22 PM Just like every other services industry, value based marketing and solution selling will win the war. There is no long term viability in priced based (commodity)marketing for a service.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 12:27 PM Anything that is marketed good will do well. It's just a fact of life. Thus, I don't see what your point is?
Posted by ldcdc, 08-12-2006, 01:54 PM That it's H-Sphere's fault that it isn't the number one/most widely used solution yet, despite its iterated and reiterated advantages? That the way people see it in comparison to cPanel is half self inflicted. That it leaves ways in which cPanel can be seen as better/cheaper/easier to use (whether true or not). Then again, maybe the focus on cPanel-Hsphere transfers is a first sign of a different approach to things?
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 01:56 PM What statistics do you have to back up that H-Sphere has less use than cPanel? Perhaps in the WHT-market, yes. H-Sphere is the control panel for the enterprise hosts that know what they are doing. cPanel is not.
Posted by Aussie Bob, 08-12-2006, 02:06 PM What stats are out there? I don't think anyone could accurately complile data as to the numbers of servers that run cpanel over h-sphere. Does a player like web.com use h-sphere's inbuilt billing and support system? I would have thought they would have built their own propriatary system. It would be difficult for h-sphere to me more widely used than cpanel, when the big dedicated server suppliers (like theplanet and ev1) bundle cpanel with bearly all of their servers.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 02:12 PM You may be correct that cPanel is more widely used, *overall*, that is. But the most popular control panel doesn't necessarily have to be the best. BTW - Bob, if you haven't already, I'd like to personally ask that you read my former post on the previous page.
Posted by Apolo, 08-12-2006, 02:19 PM and I believe H-sphere licensing scheme has a lot to do with it. It would be a lot cheaper to run a big cPanel server with say 800 domains/accounts compared to run a server with 800 H-Shere licenses. Just my 2 cents.
Posted by mripguru, 08-12-2006, 02:48 PM I disagree - because your looking only at the server/bandwidth prices. What about support staff? billing staff? Licenses for outside (related) applications such as helpdesk, billing manager, etc.? I think if you do a *full* TCO analysis - you'll find that H-Sphere is a cheaper solution long-term than any of it's competitors in the marketplace today because you can provide more service with less staff (comparatively to a cPanel environment) and more automation which increases productivity and allows the marketing machine to operate more efficiently in order to close sales. Also, on a technical level - H-Sphere doesn't have many "odd bugs" as cPanel does that tend to crop up from time to time (if any) so the time to fix those bugs is minimal. Also, what about upgrades of software installed on the servers? H-Sphere's upgraders/installers automatically upgrade software across the whole cluster whereas with cPanel - you would have to upgrade each server individually by hand causing more time to be spent per upgrade. Sure, you can enable auto-updates within cPanel - but I find that that's an irresponsible thing to do if you want to maintain constant stability. Also, what about the ability to have a birds-eye view of your whole company/enterprise from one screen that talks to all of the web, database, email, etc. servers that can give you a pretty good idea about the health of your business/servers - can cPanel offer you a consolidated view like that? Nope. All in all, I think your looking at only a very small subset of what H-Sphere prices and can save in prices. There's more to what you allude to with cPanel being a cheaper entry-level solution (which I'm not denying, it is). However, cPanel just doesn't have the billing, scalability and features that H-Sphere has. Thanks....
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 02:48 PM You can keep your 2 cents. In the short term, maybe you will think it's cheaper, but you are wrong. 1 - cPanel has higher systems administration prices. Bugs just crop up. I'm not just kidding around here. When you have 800 accounts the server doesn't just run itself. cPanel isn't as bad as once was, but it's still not very good. The coding is absolute garbage, many functions do not work as they were intended. 2 - cPanel has a recurring license cost. In the long run, this can add up. H-Sphere is just a one time fee, ~ $5/license, but obviously it goes down with volume. I'm sure most if not all customers wouldn't mind paying a $5 setup fee, or opting for quarterly, annually, or bi-anually payment. 3 - H-Sphere's licensing scheme is per H-Sphere instance. You can have multiple domains in one H-Sphere instance. Whereas with cPanel, most people use WHM to do multiple domains resulting in a cPanel account per domain. This means that all people need is one account if they want to do multi-domain hosting via H-Sphere. This is just yet another flaw in your reasoning. 4 - You do not need to pay for an external billing system through H-Sphere. Decent billing systems can cost quite a bit. Especially if you choose to purchase it outright. But, if you do not choose to purchase it outright, you will have to pay a recurring cost. 5 - The support ticket system is also integrated with H-Sphere. If you choose to use, then you can save money there as well. However, many choose to not, as there are some very good external support systems available, such as Kayako or Cerberus. So you are free to exclude this point. 6 - You will receive less support tickets therefore will need to have less staff available at any given time. This is because many operations are fully integrated via H-Sphere, such as upgrading your account, registering and adding a new domain. Requesting shell access (all an admin has to do is click "Accept" in the ACP under the shell manager), as another example. 7 - Less work for accounting. Invoices, etc. are all done seamlessly through H-Sphere. An account will automatically be suspended after X days (you specify) of non-payment, etc. Through automation you save money, by purchasing licenses outright you save money. H-Sphere is all about cutting prices and increasing efficiency and performance. I conclude, cPanel is more expensive than H-Sphere, in almost every way. Thank you.
Posted by mripguru, 08-12-2006, 02:52 PM Also, there are some companies out there that lease H-Sphere licenses for $0.50/license per month in packs of 50 licenses - so you can defray some of the upfront prices that way, thus bringing it down closer to cPanel level pricing (in the short term).
Posted by 2Macs Jim, 08-12-2006, 02:53 PM Cheaper, ok, but have you concidered the additional support? Add ons? Inability to offer more such as items that have already been mentioned, (clusters/ multi platform etc., etc)? I could go on and on. Remember, as many of us say here, you get what you pay for. It's a simple and plain fact, H-Sphere has it all over the others. Ok, IMHO I've used CPanel in the past, yes it's buggy but it was ok at the time. Once someone goes to H-Sphere though I would guess it's seldom they go back. We wouldn't!
Posted by mripguru, 08-12-2006, 02:59 PM and those licenses are completely reusable once a client cancels, thus you can make even more money when you reuse the license with a new $5 (it's actually lower than this) setup fee.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 03:12 PM They use their inbuilt billing system - yes - you would be simply crazy not to (most larger providers do not use the inbuilt helpdesk - but, its easy to plug in the 3rd party helpdesk of your choice - and many bridges exist).. People talking about the integrated billing feature in hsphere in this thread really do not understand how it works or what the ramifications are. This conversation is almost reminding me of watching my father run his business - where he did everything on pen and paper and used one of those old calculators with the rolls on top to calculate every column and double and triple check everything. I will never forget the day I showed him a basic accounting program on a computer and showed him how to use it - he simply laughed it off and went back to his pen and paper. Fact of the matter is, no business now do their books this way - it is inefficient, prone to errors and out dated. You simply will not see hosts of the future perform manual billing like they currently do with cpanel and your favorite billing plugin - it makes no sense in any respect - it is just people hanging onto what they are familiar with... BTW - cpanel is now starting to work on the same sort of solution - Any total cost of ownership study over 6,12,18 or 24 months will show that you are incorrect... I can tell you with certainty that we require 2-3 less human resources compared to a comparable sized cpanel host. Thats a savings of anywhere from $90k-$150k+/year in savings utilizing automation - can you please explain to me how licensing prices even matter? This is exactly why hsphere is releasing single server versions, data center versions, etc - to target that audience... and this leads directly to what Dan was saying about marketing - and he is right - cpanel has the jump on marketing and market segment - however, do not confuse the jump on marketing and current market share with the ultimate end result in the marketplace. The best product with the best value statement will ultimately win - just ask IBM what happened to their PC market which they once owned 100% market share in (they are in fact out of the PC business altogether now)... I know on this board cpanel is a holy grail - and that is fine - I dont mind swimming upstream - but, remember, this is an hsphere thread - and if I had hsphere in my signature, I would be accused of sig pimping - now, I am simply accused of being self serving... There is 2 sides to this story - and I look forward to watching the results unfold over time...
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 03:12 PM ooops - duplicate post Last edited by cartika-andrew; 08-12-2006 at 03:15 PM.
Posted by Apolo, 08-12-2006, 03:14 PM Come on guys, chill out. I wasn't mentioning advantages/disadvantages of one over the other one. I'm only comparing licensing prices. Plain and simple. What I was doing is a simple, plan math exercise, when you, as a hosting provider, need to offer a control panel to your customer to perform basic operations: 800 licenses of H-Sphere: I believe you can purchase them for around $4.5 per license, so it would mean $3,600 one time fee. Ok, say you're big enough and can get them at, say, $2.5 per license, so it would mean an upfront payment of $2,000 Then you have to pay 20% of that amount every year, to get support and upgrades. 1 license of cPanel to run 800 domains: I believe you can lease it for around $15-$45 per month depending on the data center fees. Not to mention that running H-Sphere on a single server would mean more server load and less performance, compared to a single cPanel server running 800 domains. Having said that, I personally don't like cPanel and I prefer H-Sphere. I believe your comment is a bit rude and not nice at all. I have the right to express my own considerations and opinions, as everyone else. Regards,
Posted by Apolo, 08-12-2006, 03:20 PM Of course, IF you take into account the benefits and advantages of H-Sphere automation system as a whole, in the long run it would be a lot cheaper.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 04:22 PM But you are making generalizations are just quite frankly highly incorrect, as expressed by many others in this thread who also share my views. I am sorry that you took it as rude though, I did not mean it in that way. The true prices were worked out by me above. No matter how you slice it, H-Sphere is just plain cheaper. Not even in the long run, since you'll quickly make your money. And by the way, where can you get a cPanel license for $15/mo? Even Layered Tech charges $25.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 04:41 PM Hi Apolo - would you not agree that if you didnt take into account ALL of the prices - then you cannot possibly determine which one is more expensive? Far too many people getting into this business arent thinking 6-12 months out - and therefore do not understand ALL of the prices involved... No one starts out with 800 customers, so the initial investment will not be as high as you have indicated - but, I must agree with you, most people do not do the calculations - which is kinda scary isnt it?
Posted by Apolo, 08-12-2006, 04:52 PM So if I don't share your views I should keep my comments away? No problem. Your true cost. It doesn't mean my example is wrong, if you're simply comparing a control panel to create email accounts and other users, to another control panel. Not everyone in this world needs a fully featured control panel with all bells & whistles. That's your opinion. And I'm OK with that. You say *even* like if they were the biggest/cheapest provider in the whole world. Right now I can remember interserver.net. They charge $15 per month for a cPanel license. Or at least that's what they advertise on their web site. Anyway, this thread isn't about cPanel.
Posted by Apolo, 08-12-2006, 04:56 PM Finally! You get my point. And I believe that where H-Sphere really shines is when you own your own cluster. Then you, from a sys admin point of view, can really enjoy all benefits of its powerful automation system. Regards.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 05:07 PM LOL - if you had just said it like that to begin with All good Apolo - I see what you are saying - and yes, that has, in the past, hurt hspheres growth as a "control panel" in so far as competing with cpanel - BUT - as the focus in this industry changes from price to value - I think you will see this change... Eitherway, I am kinda shooting myself in the foot here - I like the fact there isnt alot of competition in our space - and hopefully, even more customers "take the pepsi challenge" before providers wise up and the competition gets stiffer
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 05:25 PM I never stated that nor implied that, but again sorry if you took it that way. H-Sphere is not about bells and whistles. It's not even about the feature set. It's about scalability, automation, and efficiency for the hosting provider. cPanel doesn't offer that, and as such is no where close. It is hard to compare the prices of both, but H-Sphere comes out cheaper in my example. And my example isn't just my opinion, it's based on real facts. Is there anything that you have to dispute about my example in specific? No, but they are one of the cheapest and do have quite a few servers in their fleet, hence they came to mind. Interesting... I never said it was, but I wasn't the first person to bring it up.
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 05:27 PM Exactly, so we all agree here on that point. I just do not agree with your statement that cPanel is cheaper, because it just quite frankly is not.
Posted by Aussie Bob, 08-12-2006, 07:16 PM Aye, so true. I would also imagine large players like web.com (interland) would also use highly customised versions of h-sphere, rather than what's off the shelf? I'm a little surprised a large player like web.com doesn't have their own propriatary control panel. It's just hosting folks. We're not curing cancer.
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 07:23 PM lol - granted - but, the people who are actually curing cancer are collaborating, communicating and documenting via hosting solutions
Posted by cartika-andrew, 08-12-2006, 07:26 PM Customized - sure - but, not highly customized... Im not - thats the silliest thing a large scale hosting provider can do - talk about a money pit with diminishing returns... Any company is better off focussing on their core competencies - and a hosting provider is MUCH better off maintaining a custom snapshot of a production control panel, rather then maintaining their own control panel... let the control panel companies focus on the control panels - thats their core competency
Posted by layer0, 08-12-2006, 08:57 PM Indeed, and even with cPanel hosts, there's plenty of customization. I know I personally run a pretty streamlined install of cPanel (I've got Apache 2.2.x to work - though still testing it . . . ), but I'm still not happy with the bugs and the lack of scalability.
Posted by CRego3D, 08-13-2006, 06:07 AM Thats mainly becuase of the licensing scheme. The "per user" licence model of H-Sphere is very good for hosts, but it's a model that datacenters are not used to, and find it hard to manage. We aim to change that, licensing on a per-server model will be available for datacenters very soon.
Posted by mripguru, 08-13-2006, 06:14 AM per single server in a cluster, or just single server clusters? (PM me if you don't want to disclose publicly)
Posted by CRego3D, 08-13-2006, 10:28 AM It will start with single server clusters, if it goes well we will consider expanding it to cover multi server clusters (on a per server license)
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